Please read Post 68 and then come back here. Thanks.
Discussions—Series Twenty-Nine
Topic 96
I wonder why so many teachers use "English teacher" instead of
"teacher of English" or "English language teacher" when
talking about their profession. They confuse profession with nationality.
Jessica Hermosilla Magaña Researcher.
Teacher of English and Spanish.
Top Contributor
Teacher of Language at Selfemployed
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Very simple dear ... they are directly translating from their own
language ... I have many Chinese students who say ... my Chinese teacher
instead of my teacher of Mandarin ... TESL is not easy ... you have to change
their mindset .....
Researcher. Teacher of English and Spanish.
Top Contributor
I can understand that some students make that mistake but I am talking
about teachers, not students. As language teachers, they must pay attention to
the way the use the L2, especially when they refer to their profession and when
others can see that as it happens on Linkedin.
Instructor
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English teacher or teacher of English are the same. English language
teacher may suggest that this person may be a TESOL instructor and not an
English teacher. And no, there is no confusion that English teacher is a
teacher of English. Just because I am an English teacher does not mean that I
am ethnically English. I see no distinction between any of them because in
English we say English teacher, Spanish teacher, etc. Can I say teacher of Spanish?
Sure, but why when it's easier to say English teacher? It is a direct
translation of the L1 when a student uses teacher of English, but it is not
wrong, just as "He is a friend of mine" is not wrong. I can just as
easily say, "He's my friend."
Simone S., K R
Lakshminarayanan and 3 others like
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Me
Top Contributor
Jessica I can see where you're going; an Indian teacher would mean a
teacher from India. Does this mean that a British national or an American would
take 'English teacher' the way you mean it? But Laura seems to say the expression
is OK as it is. Please clarify.
online tutor
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Good question! What's a maths teacher then? English is just the name of
the subject and not an adjective in this context. I don't think you could say
an Indian teacher, because there is no such language. An Australian teacher of
English wouldn't be an Australian teacher, would they? People often talk about
a Chinese teacher because they don't know that there is more than one version
or they think it's obvious which one it is. I would say I'm an EFL tutor or a
tutor of English as a Foreign Language.
K R
Lakshminarayanan, Prof.Iyer
Baalank like this
A math teacher is a math teacher. An English teacher teaches either
writing in English, grammar in English, speaking/listening in English, and
reading English. All my teachers who taught me English in school were and are
English teachers. I teach English. Australians speak English and therefore they
will teach Australian English and a British person will teach British English.
I am an American and so I teach American English. When I teach writing to
Americans, I tell them I am teaching them Academic English so I do not offend
speakers of Black English. A Chinese person who taught the language of Chinese
would be a Chinese teacher. An English person who taught Chinese would be a
Chinese teacher. If the teacher is teaching one of the many languages of
Chinese instead of Mandarin, then that teacher would be _______ teacher.
English language has thousands of words that have double or triple duties and
such is the reason for English teacher. If I want to specify, then I do. Many
of my students were taught British English, which is all fine and good UNTIL
differences are reached (punctuation especially). It is not hard for students
to understand that in the United States and as an American, I am teaching them
AmerEnglish. In the U.S., we follow American English rules. In the EU, we
follow British English rules. My program is English Language Program at one
college and at another I teach Developmental English -- I teach English. Am I
the same type of teacher a native would find in public grammar school? No. I am
a linguist and that is my training, with a declared master's in TESOL. I teach
English. I am an English teacher. In Britain, I would probably be defined as an
American English teacher because that is the language I teach. If a Brit taught
American English, that Brit would be an American-English teacher. The hyphen
can help with some things since it makes a distinction in how the adjective is
applied and said. I'm off to teach English now! :-)
Prof.Iyer
Baalank, Giovanna B. like
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Researcher. Teacher of English and Spanish.
Top Contributor
Laura: You said "English teacher or teacher of English are the
same". They are not. An English teacher means that the person is English.
We are talking about the nationality.
Then you said: "English language teacher may suggest that this person may be a TESOL instructor and not an English teacher". This is not the case. This is another way to refer to the profession. Adding "language" makes us know that we are not talking about the nationality.
Being an English teacher does mean that the person is English.
Then you said: "English language teacher may suggest that this person may be a TESOL instructor and not an English teacher". This is not the case. This is another way to refer to the profession. Adding "language" makes us know that we are not talking about the nationality.
Being an English teacher does mean that the person is English.
You admitted that saying "English teacher is easier". But
easier does not mean it is correct.
Then you said "it is a direct translation of the L1 when a student uses teacher of English". Do you mean it is a literal translation?
Then you said "it is a direct translation of the L1 when a student uses teacher of English". Do you mean it is a literal translation?
You can say "He is a friend of mine" or "He's my
friend." But this is different, there is no confusion. A language is not
the literal translation of another language, it deals with the way people who
belong to a certain culture express themselves.
Anne: I think that you are talking about something very different. We
cannot compare "a maths teacher" with "an English teacher".
Maths has nothing to do with nationality. We are talking about using a word
that refers to a profession and another that refers to nationality. We cannot
talk about "science teacher" and "English teacher" in the
same way, as the word "science" clearly refers to the subject.
K R Lakshminarayanan: I think you are right. An Indian teacher is a
teacher from India. Another example: "English soldier", "Spanish
soldier", "English teacher", Spanish teacher". We are
talking about the nationality.
I think that the problem arises when we use the word "English"
for example, to refer to a subject without considering that it also refers to a
nationality. And that is why we say "English language teacher", using
the word "language" to make the difference between that phrase and
"English teacher". And we also use "teacher of English"
that is a bit more specific.
K R
Lakshminarayanan likes this
Laura: I think that you talk about too many things that are not
pertinent to the topic. You also said "If a Brit taught American English,
that Brit would be an American-English teacher". Please, think about it,
American English is an accent or could refer to literature, but that is not a
profession.
I think that probably if you were talking about an English teacher as in
nationality, the stress would be on English as opposed to on teacher, perhaps
to show contrast. I'm an English teacher but my friend is Scottish. I think
usually it would be clear from context. It isn't really true to say that
American English is just an accent. I could also say that I am a standard
British English teacher. I am certainly not teaching Geordie. Or perhaps it
should be bog-standard!! I could also say that sadly, English does not actually
count officially as a nationality anyway. Hence the need to tick "United
Kingdom" boxes.
Prof.Iyer
Baalank likes this
Maitre de Langue at University of Versailles Saint Quentin-en-Yvelines
I'm a prof d'anglais (that simplifies it all for me, lol). I'm a kiwi
but I probably wouldn't say kiwi teacher otherwise people would wonder why
birds need teaching. I think English teacher and teacher of English are both
correct. You do need to watch the stress and context to get the meaning correct
though. An English TEACHER would suggest the teacher was from England but an
ENGLISH teacher would be someone like me.
Giovanna B., Laura Eyler and 2 others like
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We need to consider the different functions of the word 'English' in
English that are possible here.
English - is a noun used to describe:
* a subject or area of study related to English language and/or literature
* the language itself (including all the regional varieties)
English - is also an adjective used to describe:
* nationality or origin of a person/thing from England
In fact, I AM an English teacher, even though I'm from New Zealand, because I teach the subject of English.
So I'm an English teacher.
I speak (NZ) English.
But I'm not English. I'm a New Zealander.
However, my sister was married to an English man. He drove an English sportscar.
All are, in fact, true and correct for me.
Native speakers aren't making a mistake - we are using the word in one of it's accepted uses.
English - is a noun used to describe:
* a subject or area of study related to English language and/or literature
* the language itself (including all the regional varieties)
English - is also an adjective used to describe:
* nationality or origin of a person/thing from England
In fact, I AM an English teacher, even though I'm from New Zealand, because I teach the subject of English.
So I'm an English teacher.
I speak (NZ) English.
But I'm not English. I'm a New Zealander.
However, my sister was married to an English man. He drove an English sportscar.
All are, in fact, true and correct for me.
Native speakers aren't making a mistake - we are using the word in one of it's accepted uses.
Giovanna B., Laura Eyler and 3 others like
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Jessica, American English is NOT an accent. British English is NOT an
accent. There are distinctions in spelling, pronunciation, punctuation,
inference, etc. American English has several different accents. If you were
familiar with the US, then you would know this. The southern states have more
pronounced diphthongs on their vowels, amongst other differences. Black English
is not necessarily in reference to African Americans but to the language
cultivated between the slaves and the Carolinas during slavery. The
southwestern US also has what is called a twang on their pronunciations. The
upper Northeast has an accent. American English is a language. British English
is a language and those speakers can place each other in an area by their
accents on English.
No, Jessica, a Mexican can teach English and that Mexican would be an English teacher whether in Mexico or the U.S. The English are The British. It is the article "the" that makes the nationality. The Chinese are people who are Chinese and who speak Chinese and a Chinese teacher can be from anywhere in the world as long as that teacher teaches that language.
If I have to add language as in English language teacher, then I am placing emphasis on the language apart from the L1 and I am focusing on language acquisition and that is it. It can be inferred that the students who are taught by this type of teacher may come out illiterate in English, but they will be able to speak the language.
Diana is correct and I understand that her sister was married to a man from England because she said Englishman. Here "English" is used as a nationality, not as a modifier to teacher.
Yes, indeedy Frances! Stress makes a difference as well! Kudos for bringing that up.
In order to understand what the teacher is teaching, we MUST use the forms available to us in our language. Native speakers have no problem understanding what subject the teacher is teaching when s/he says that s/he is a Spanish teacher. My French teacher in high school was not from France. The Spanish teacher was not from Spain. If you are teaching English where you are, then you are an English teacher. You would also be a teacher of English. It makes no difference although the accepted form in English is Adjective + Noun. If the only adjective we have is English, Chinese, Tibetan, Parsi then we MUST use it as an adjective. Teacher is a noun. In and of itself, there is no distinction in subject area. In order to indicate what the subject area being taught is, we MUST modify it; thus, English teacher.
No, Jessica, a Mexican can teach English and that Mexican would be an English teacher whether in Mexico or the U.S. The English are The British. It is the article "the" that makes the nationality. The Chinese are people who are Chinese and who speak Chinese and a Chinese teacher can be from anywhere in the world as long as that teacher teaches that language.
If I have to add language as in English language teacher, then I am placing emphasis on the language apart from the L1 and I am focusing on language acquisition and that is it. It can be inferred that the students who are taught by this type of teacher may come out illiterate in English, but they will be able to speak the language.
Diana is correct and I understand that her sister was married to a man from England because she said Englishman. Here "English" is used as a nationality, not as a modifier to teacher.
Yes, indeedy Frances! Stress makes a difference as well! Kudos for bringing that up.
In order to understand what the teacher is teaching, we MUST use the forms available to us in our language. Native speakers have no problem understanding what subject the teacher is teaching when s/he says that s/he is a Spanish teacher. My French teacher in high school was not from France. The Spanish teacher was not from Spain. If you are teaching English where you are, then you are an English teacher. You would also be a teacher of English. It makes no difference although the accepted form in English is Adjective + Noun. If the only adjective we have is English, Chinese, Tibetan, Parsi then we MUST use it as an adjective. Teacher is a noun. In and of itself, there is no distinction in subject area. In order to indicate what the subject area being taught is, we MUST modify it; thus, English teacher.
Anne Fraser, Giovanna B. and 3 others like
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Professor of English at PES School 0f Engineering,Bangalore
Top Contributor
Jessica dear! Am I correct in calling myself as 'Professor of English'?
Funnily enough, I think it is much more common to say Professor of.....
I completely agree with Diana and Laura, (although I wouldn't say the English
are the British - contentious in the rest of the UK!). My last Spanish teacher
was English. I never referred to her as an English Spanish teacher or a
non-Spanish Spanish teacher. If you wanted to clarify, you could just say the
Spanish teacher is from England or is English. Easy really.
Prof.Iyer
Baalank, Laura Eyler like
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LAURA: Sorry but I do not agree with you. I do think American English is
an accent.
According to Cambridge dictionary, the "English definition of “accent” is
noun the way that someone speaks, showing where he or she comes from:
a British accent
a French accent
I think that American English does not have different accents, it has different dialects and sociolect and idiolect.
According to Oxford University dictionary:
"A dialect is a non-standard form of language that is used in a particular local region. Examples of English dialects are Geordie (from NE England, especially Tyneside) and Scouse (from Liverpool). Here are some examples of dialect words included in the Oxford Dictionary of English. Words described as ‘northern English’ may be from any northern English regional dialect:
standard English: alley; northern English: ginnel; Scottish: vennel."
On the other hand, you said that "we MUST use the forms available to us in our language". However, using what is available does not mean it is correct.
Is it the same to say "Spanish teachers are on strike" and "teachers of Spanish are on strike"?
According to Cambridge dictionary, the "English definition of “accent” is
noun the way that someone speaks, showing where he or she comes from:
a British accent
a French accent
I think that American English does not have different accents, it has different dialects and sociolect and idiolect.
According to Oxford University dictionary:
"A dialect is a non-standard form of language that is used in a particular local region. Examples of English dialects are Geordie (from NE England, especially Tyneside) and Scouse (from Liverpool). Here are some examples of dialect words included in the Oxford Dictionary of English. Words described as ‘northern English’ may be from any northern English regional dialect:
standard English: alley; northern English: ginnel; Scottish: vennel."
On the other hand, you said that "we MUST use the forms available to us in our language". However, using what is available does not mean it is correct.
Is it the same to say "Spanish teachers are on strike" and "teachers of Spanish are on strike"?
Me
I'm sorry but I'm getting a contradictory picture. As an Indian, I have
no problem saying I'm an English teacher (meaning a teacher of English). When I
say I'm a Tamil teacher, my statement is understood as teacher Tamil but if I
were to refer to regions where Tamil is the mother tongue I'd say I'm a
Tamilian (adding the English suffix).
Prof.Iyer
Baalank, Laura Eyler like
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Nicely done K R! Jessica, your original question was about accent, not
dialect. The two are completely different.
AmerEnglish is a language just as BritEnglish is a language; accents are different. An American can affect a British accent and a Brit can affect an American accent. In fact, many viewers in this country did not know that Hugh Laurie (House) is a British English actor with the attendant British accent on English.
Since English is ruled by word order, then the forms of the word must adhere to the order the language requires. I cannot say in English and be correct the following: "Staying you are way in the" anymore than I could say: Englishly teachers are Englished when their teaching in countrying. First of all, there is no adverb or participial form of English. English has only one form. That one form can be used as noun or adjective. We have TONS of words with one form that have multiple functions. Ponder "for." "For" is a preposition and it is a conjunction. Verbs have forms (infinitive, simple, past, present participle, past participle). I must use the correct form of the verb to make a good sentence. I cannot simply put forms of words in random order nor can I make up forms where none exist.
Yes Jessica, Spanish teachers are on strike is the same as teachers of Spanish are on strike. If I meant the Spanish, I would add the article and change my stress on Spanish to indicate nationality. The SPAnish teachers are on strike. Yes, stress naturally falls on the "spa" but if I am indicating nationality I place emphasis on the natural stress, making it sound especially stronger.
Until you have visited the regions of the South, the Southwest, and the Northeast in the United States, then you will remain unaware of these accents on English. Reporters have a mid-western accent on English, which in AmerEnglish is the least accented. That is probably what you are used to hearing. Chicagoans have a nasal accent on words. Take, for example, the name Paulina. Mid-westerners will pronounce Paulina as follows \ˈpȯ-ˌlēnə\. Chicago accents say the same word: \'pȯ-ˈlīnə\. When I first moved to Chicago from downstate and told the taxi to take me to \ˈpȯ-ˌlēnə\ and Lawrence, he did not understand \ˈpȯ-ˌlēnə\ until I spelled it for him. He then politely told me that in Chicago, they say \'pȯ-ˈlīnə\. This is an example of accent.
AmerEnglish is a language just as BritEnglish is a language; accents are different. An American can affect a British accent and a Brit can affect an American accent. In fact, many viewers in this country did not know that Hugh Laurie (House) is a British English actor with the attendant British accent on English.
Since English is ruled by word order, then the forms of the word must adhere to the order the language requires. I cannot say in English and be correct the following: "Staying you are way in the" anymore than I could say: Englishly teachers are Englished when their teaching in countrying. First of all, there is no adverb or participial form of English. English has only one form. That one form can be used as noun or adjective. We have TONS of words with one form that have multiple functions. Ponder "for." "For" is a preposition and it is a conjunction. Verbs have forms (infinitive, simple, past, present participle, past participle). I must use the correct form of the verb to make a good sentence. I cannot simply put forms of words in random order nor can I make up forms where none exist.
Yes Jessica, Spanish teachers are on strike is the same as teachers of Spanish are on strike. If I meant the Spanish, I would add the article and change my stress on Spanish to indicate nationality. The SPAnish teachers are on strike. Yes, stress naturally falls on the "spa" but if I am indicating nationality I place emphasis on the natural stress, making it sound especially stronger.
Until you have visited the regions of the South, the Southwest, and the Northeast in the United States, then you will remain unaware of these accents on English. Reporters have a mid-western accent on English, which in AmerEnglish is the least accented. That is probably what you are used to hearing. Chicagoans have a nasal accent on words. Take, for example, the name Paulina. Mid-westerners will pronounce Paulina as follows \ˈpȯ-ˌlēnə\. Chicago accents say the same word: \'pȯ-ˈlīnə\. When I first moved to Chicago from downstate and told the taxi to take me to \ˈpȯ-ˌlēnə\ and Lawrence, he did not understand \ˈpȯ-ˌlēnə\ until I spelled it for him. He then politely told me that in Chicago, they say \'pȯ-ˈlīnə\. This is an example of accent.
Prof.Iyer
Baalank likes this
Laura: Sorry but I think you need to read more about the meaning of
language, accent, dialect, sociolect and idiolect to understand the difference
betweeen them. If you say that "AmerEnglish is a language just as
BritEnglish is a language". This is completely wrong. There is no such
thing. It is like saying that Colombian Spanish is a language and Chilean
Spanish is a language, and every single country has a different language. There
are different accents, and different dialects.
On the other hand, you said "Jessica, your original question was
about accent, not dialect". I have not asked any question about accent or
dialect. I talked about the definitions only because you said that
"American English is NOT an accent. British English is NOT an
accent". But they are different accents of the same language: English.
So Portuguese is Spanish with a different accent by your definition.
Yippee. I am enlightened. Is the horse dead yet?
Richard Kelleher, Bill McGowan like
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Founding Principal at FAR NSW Holdings Trust
What a 'crock' subject ! I have been a teacher of English, vis-a-vis
English teacher, in over 8 countries in numerous regions of the world. Language
is contextual, and when one uses the terms 'English teacher', most people
understand the intended meaning being conveyed by the speaker/writer. This
topic, in my view, has its seeds in the mindset of a bored teacher of English
with little meaningful topics to pursue. Why not devote more time to exploring
with others significant phenomenon related to language learning, such as
'obstacles' that adult learners of L2 experience and how to ameliorate such ?
Please lets 'let-go' of this 'no brainer' topic !
Prof.Iyer
Baalank, Laura Eyler and 3 others like
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Learning Counsellor at TQ Education & Training
No, they don't. English is sometimes a subject in school or University
and sometimes a nationality. I'm a native speaker, so I'm pretty sure I don't
confuse nationality and subject and I'm also pretty sure I'm not making a
mistake. Mr. Context will save the day!
Prof.Iyer
Baalank, Laura Eyler and 2 others like
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Most languages are contextual. And, when learning a second language (L2)
the functional aspects of language use (sending and receiving a message) are
primary and fundamental. The acquisition and use of the structural aspects of
language, in a more sophisticated manner (i.e. syntax, mechanics, etc), come
with practice and further targeted learning. I would like to read more
discussion on such topics; the nexus (of sorts) between functional and
structural aspects of language learning and educating. Furthermore, there is
also a growing number of adult language (L2) learners in the world - the L2
being English, Mandarin and Spanish. In Australia, the learning of Indonesian
is also on the increase. I would like to read some more thoughtful discussion
on 'obstacles' that adult learners of an L2, or as multi-lingual learners,
encounter, and what methods and approaches can be used to ameliorate the impact
of such on the adult language learning process.
Let's move-in from a debate on the semantics of what those involved in
the learning and educating of English call themselves. Oh, by the way, in
passing (I hope) I call myself an English Language Educator (Ltn: educare-to
enable) and................ what is the size of a grapefruit ?
Some 'smart' academic may find this a useful PhD topic.
I try to deal with the real world !
Some 'smart' academic may find this a useful PhD topic.
I try to deal with the real world !
Prof.Iyer
Baalank, Richard Kelleher like
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Yes indeedy!
Richard Kelleher likes
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Private Tuition, Brain-Gym(R), Dyslexia Training
Another native speaker and English teacher here. I would like to agree
with the person who mentioned Maths teachers and Science teachers. English,
too, is a subject being learnt, thus a noun in this instance. We therefore have
compound nouns here. And, as others have pointed out, context and intonation
will deal with any doubts as to exact meaning. Jessica, what came first?
Language as it is used or the theory written about in books? If you really want
to know the facts, don't believe everything you read in books. Get out there
and listen to the native speakers using the language. Do your own research. And
stop telling native speakers how to speak their own language! That is rude!
Elena G., Prof.Iyer Baalank and 3 others like
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I invite comments on this message sent to me:
Quote:
"stop telling native speakers how to speak their own language! That is rude!"
You are quite arrogant and pedantic. It is obvious you are not a professional.
Unquote
No, Jessica, my dear girl, just truthful! And maybe, while you're at it, you'd like to define the word "professional"? No, on second thoughts, please don't.
Quote:
"stop telling native speakers how to speak their own language! That is rude!"
You are quite arrogant and pedantic. It is obvious you are not a professional.
Unquote
No, Jessica, my dear girl, just truthful! And maybe, while you're at it, you'd like to define the word "professional"? No, on second thoughts, please don't.
Laura Eyler likes
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When studying for my masters' in Applied Linguistics, one of my instructors
told our class that only native speakers know their grammar; thus, no matter
what the native speaker speaks, his/her language is correct. Isn't that neat?
Even when an L1 is wrong, s/he is right because on the L1 knows what is right.
Errrr....your instructor did not (I believe) inform you entirely
accurately. Because persons whom acquire their mother tongue are immersed into
the L1, in the home before they commence formal education, then the processes
for how one learns the syntax (grammar and mechanics) of an L2 is somewhat
different to that of one whom acquires competency and proficiency in L1,
especially the structural aspects of language learning. It is not a matter of
whom is right and wrong, better or lesser, faster or slower, it is a matter of
DIFFERENT processes for different learners of either a L1 or L2 or multiple
languages. Let's not forget that many people in the world (i.e. Philippines,
PNG, Malaysia, etc) are raised, and then formally educated, in multi-lingual
situations. I sense that some commentators here are attempting to make this
debate into a race-based argument on language learning. This would be a shame !
Scratch below the skin surface, and we are all fundamentally the same and all
people can be 'connected' through dance and song and food...............which
often come before learning either a L1 or L2.
Whom can 'judge' if a person is truly being 'rude' and 'arrogant' and
'pedantic' ? It is unfortunate that the passions of some commentators have
resulted in them being less than careful and caring with their chosen comments.
When it comes to being a 'professional'.......well this is another 'what size
is a grapefruit' question. I have worked with persons whom have had no formal
qualifications in a particular field, and their workplace behaviours, attitudes
and applied skills-sets have been highly commendable -very professional. I have
also worked with some persons whom have had more letters behind their name than
in their full name, but they have limited people skills, cannot work well in a
team, and think they know much more than what they actually do........and try
telling them that !
One of my education mentors said to me (good counsel I believe): "....If you want to get the best out of people find out what they are good at and build them up on that....."
One of my education mentors said to me (good counsel I believe): "....If you want to get the best out of people find out what they are good at and build them up on that....."
The word 'educator' derives from the Latin - to enable, to build-up. So,
a 'professional educator' would, one would think and hope, be dedicated to
'building-up' all people that she/he comes into contact with. It would be nice
if we had lots more 'professional educators' in the world...........
K R
Lakshminarayanan likes this
And so it goes...the misuse of "whom." Oh well...L1s can make
the error because it is the L1s error and s/he knows better. The L2 hears the
error and repeats it and it becomes an error because the L2 (or 3 through
infinity) needs must be corrected by the L1 who knows the rules and syntax yet
breaks them both.
K R
Lakshminarayanan likes this
Laura, it seems to be that you are more interested in 'bringing down'
people on minor errors, rather than building them up. I may be wrong. We all
make errors, L1s, L2s and multi-lingual persons. From my observations, I may be
'in error', but I have found that many L1 do not 'know' the actual rules of
grammar, they have acquired, over time in an immersion situation, the correct
use of syntax.......most of the time. Your commentary on L1's and L2's, and
their apparent proficiency and competency in a given language, is very
combative. Have you got another agenda that you are trying to address through
this discourse ? As I understand contemporary debate, among linguists and
language teachers, the 'jury is still out', from an empirical viewpoint, on the
peculiarities associated with L1 and L2 acquiring and learning the structural
aspects of language. Chomsky (LAD), and Vygotsky and others, have written, at
different chapters in history, thought-provoking papers on language acquisition
and language learning, for both L1, L2 and multi-lingual language learners, but
none of the theories have stood the test of empiricism. I am pleased to have a
strong debate on any topic related to language acquisition and language
learning, but I do not want to get bogged-down on petty point-scoring.
"....Life is the 'journey' (how we travel it), not the destination....
(Dalai Lama)
Jessica, In Carer or professions, Definition is always simple and well
chracterized, Teacher of English sounds very ODD AND UNETHICAL and can never be
used, Those of us who teach like MATHS, is always known as Maths Teacher and
not teacher of Maths so I hope this helps you to grasp more, It is good you
asked because asking helps us to enhance our knowledge. I really disagree with
my co contributor Laura, there is no way you quantify a teacher no matter which
subject as teacher of, Please lets not send the wrong message to students who
read our comments it will amout to murdering of our profession and that
intergrity we all have. Do you refer to an electronic engineer as engineer of
electronic?please lets be very mindful.
Learning Counsellor at TQ Education & Training
I didn't mean to stir up such a hornet's nest with my comment about
being a native speaker, therefore being sure I'm not making a mistake! What I
meant was that I'd acquired the rule of use for that language and that it's
stood the test of time so I'm confident in it. I've also got 30 years teaching,
a DTEFLA and an MA to rely on for insight as well. Of course native speakers
need to do their language analysis just as non-native speakers do and I
wouldn't make a value judgement about L1 and L2 speakers each of whom bring
valuable insights to the job. It just seems fairly clear to me that Jessica is
labouring under a misconception. I very much doubt that she intended to be
rude.
K R
Lakshminarayanan likes this
Regards to Mr. Stephen's comment, I think Jessica is not only of
misconception but I think she is completely out of contest, even look at her
Name she put teacher of English, I hope she get to perspective and dont
misleading those she thought she is teaching rather distroying them and their
understanding
LOLOL And let's let the academic egos soar out of control! C'mon group,
get your egos out of joint and let's just all try to respect each others'
comments for what they are. Contributions. All of this "you are
wrong" bovine feces is clearly indicative of academic posturing. It's been
a long time since I've had this much fun! Let sun shine where we shan't put it!
LOLOLO
Yes Laura, absolutely that is what we all be doing, sharing and
expressing freely. it will help us make up where we came short.
I agree with you
I agree with you
Don't mince your words Laura. Tell us what you really think!
I think we also need to lighten up and maintain a sense of humour,
perspective and professional courtesy. I do think that errors need to be
corrected. If you see that as "bovine faeces" , Laura, as your
charming expression went, then we are going to have to agree to differ.
Hello Stephen, yes I think Laura was not comfortable with issues raised
which I think gives negative opinion if we dont accept and see views raised as
an advice
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